+- Forum | Merseyside Dennis Dart Website (http://dartslf.com/forum)
+-- Forum: Buses (/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Local Bus Scene: North West and Wales (/forumdisplay.php?fid=2)
+--- Thread: Greater Manchester Franchising (/showthread.php?tid=1676)
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - Barney - 26/03/2021 13:54
(26/03/2021 13:30)EDB325 Wrote: Announced this morning that Rotala's Judicial Enquiry is scheduled for May. Stagecoach have theirs scheduled for April 27/8. I personally think Stagecoach are wasting their money. If I'm right, Rotala will probably pull the plug on theirs.
In many ways this mirrors what the PTEs did in a vain attempt to overturn the 1985 Transport Act that brought in bus deregulation and I very much doubt whether Stagecoach or Rotala will be able to prevent this decision to introduce franchising.
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - WhiteVanMan - 26/03/2021 15:18
(26/03/2021 06:37)M60lad Wrote: Another interesting thing is that despite Stagecoach and Diamond saying their not interested in Franchising and want a judicial review into the way things have been handled First who exited London because of Franchising haven't said a thing to my knowledge so looks like they might be staying in Manchester and seeing what happens.
Are you sure that First exited London, because of Bus Franchising?, Wasn't Bus Franchising introduced in London at the same time as de-regulation in 1986? First exited London in 2013.
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - MTL0201 - 26/03/2021 16:12
(26/03/2021 15:18)WhiteVanMan Wrote: Are you sure that First exited London, because of Bus Franchising?, Wasn't Bus Franchising introduced in London at the same time as de-regulation in 1986? First exited London in 2013.
Indeed, First exited London because they were/are in debt, that they've sold other depots outside London too because of the debt they're in, nothing to do with franchising
I'm in too minds about franchising, it needs to be properly funded & i'm not convinced it's going to be properly funded, look at TFL at the moment, they're in debt & have had to cut routes, & or frequencies & that's before the virus hit.
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - WhiteVanMan - 26/03/2021 20:22
(26/03/2021 16:12)MTL0201 Wrote: Indeed, First exited London because they were/are in debt, that they've sold other depots outside London too because of the debt they're in, nothing to do with franchising
Same with the all mighty Stagecoach, who sold their London operations for £263.6m in 2006.
Then re-acquired it in 2010 for only £59.5m.
(26/03/2021 16:12)MTL0201 Wrote: I'm in too minds about franchising, it needs to be properly funded & i'm not convinced it's going to be properly funded, look at TFL at the moment, they're in debt & have had to cut routes, & or frequencies & that's before the virus hit.
I am of the same opinion.
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - Mrboo - 26/03/2021 21:40
(26/03/2021 20:22)WhiteVanMan Wrote: Same with the all mighty Stagecoach, who sold their London operations for £263.6m in 2006.
Then re-acquired it in 2010 for only £59.5m.
I am of the same opinion.
Was a funny one that a bank offered silly money Stagecoach took the money. But the Bank asked them to look after payroll you also have to think what power Stagecoach has with prices they pay for things unlike a bank with a few bus depot that did not even have there own payroll. And Stagecoach Self insure dont know if that bank could.
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - Michael - 26/03/2021 23:01
(26/03/2021 15:18)WhiteVanMan Wrote: Are you sure that First exited London, because of Bus Franchising?, Wasn't Bus Franchising introduced in London at the same time as de-regulation in 1986? First exited London in 2013.
Francising was introduced in London in 1987 first was created by the merger of badgerline & grampian regional transport in 1994, so I don't think first pulled out of London because of francising
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - Mrboo - 27/03/2021 07:33
Going to be interesting how Go North West is going to deal with as it looks like most of there routes going in first Stage. As looking at the maps the Free City bus / Salford routes are also on map of first stage as it Bolton / Wigan / Salford. or is it the depots in that area.
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - Michael - 27/03/2021 09:07
(27/03/2021 07:33)Mrboo Wrote: Going to be interesting how Go North West is going to deal with as it looks like most of there routes going in first Stage. As looking at the maps the Free City bus / Salford routes are also on map of first stage as it Bolton / Wigan / Salford. or is it the depots in that area.
Stagecoach Middleton is stage 2 so I would think Queens Rd would be to.Hyde Rd is stage 3 so what happens with the 34&38s which operate in the area of stage 1
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - Mrboo - 27/03/2021 09:18
(27/03/2021 09:07)Michael Wrote: Stagecoach Middleton is stage 2 so I would think Queens Rd would be to.Hyde Rd is stage 3 so what happens with the 34&38s which operate in the area of stage 1
Goto Page 1485 and you see City centre is in first sage but would be due to free bus and V1 but they did not Say Salford only that Bolton an Wigan was first.
https://democracy.greatermanchester-ca.gov.uk/documents/g4423/Public%20reports%20pack%2019th-Mar-2021%2012.00%20Greater%20Manchester%20Housing%20Planning%20and%20Environmen%E2%80%8Bt%20Overvi.pdf?T=10)
RE: Greater Manchester Franchising - knutstransport - 28/03/2021 10:16
(26/03/2021 10:59)Rodney259 Wrote: Franchising sort of works in London because of subsidies from the congestion charge which, without it would mean hugely increased fares. I am sure that motorists will be absolutely delighted to pay high congestion charges so that bus tickets can be cheaper. Think it’s a great idea for the ‘rich’ (NOT!!) motorists to subsidise ever decreasing bus passengers. Why not introduce charges in for office workers to subsidise pubs and bank workers to subsidise takeaways? There are all the controls that the Council needs to run them more effectively but the trouble is that all politicians are unable to run the proverbial booze up in a brewery but are extremely happy to waste taxpayers money and blame everyone else for their failings.
Cities like London were congested with cars and had extremely high levels of pollution, it made sense to do something to encourage people to switch to greener modes of travel.
I know people who live in Greater Manchester and who drive to work who have come unstuck when a problem has arisen meaning either their car is unavailable or they are unable to drive it and they need to look at public transport instead, only to find there isn't a suitable public transport option. I know of one person from Oldham who had to pay £25 per day in taxi fares (and hoping his insurer would refund it) after someone hit him on his motorbike and he had no motorbike to ride and even if he had been provided a courtesy one he wouldn't have been able to ride it. Not everyone works in the city centre so the trams every few minutes couldn't get him to work.
I'm not sure I understand your office workers subsiding pubs statement, given that many pubs benefit from office workers going there for their lunch or after work drinks.