Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

[Barney]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(17/10/2018 08:59)MPTE1955 Wrote:  I remember that site, became the car park for the heritage market on a Sunday, strange place for a rail station with Sandhills being a very short distance away.

It's more than a mile between the two locations and much closer to Bramley-Moore dock though it probably doesn't seem that way when actually travelling on the train.

Also, I seem to recall that the P+R wasn't popular with LCC because most of the people who used it drove in from the Sefton area. Now that we have an elected mayor for the LCR - I don't know his name because I've never heard or seen him express any policies in the local media - perhaps he could re-examine the whole issue of P+R schemes to reduce congestion within central Liverpool.

[iMarkeh]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(16/10/2018 22:47)Y474 KNF Wrote:  Whenever I go past a taxi rank in the city centre during the day there are usually a number of taxis waiting for a fare. Where would they wait for fares if you changed the taxi ranks into bus stops?

That will never happen. It would cost far too much money and also remove three parking spaces for disabled drivers. Where would you put those?

It was one whole idea. Though it would be costly, it would free up bus stops, layovers and ease congestion. Disabled parking spaces are all over Liverpool. Losing 3 won't be a big loss. I would like to add as well, if there are so many taxis waiting for a fare, I think it says a lot about the demand. So many taxi ranks, so many taxis. Very rarely see many taxis leave with passengers so really, there is far more supply than there is demand.

(17/10/2018 05:37)MPTE1955 Wrote:  More idealistic rubbish from some people on here, I'll start with the 79s issue with every other bus missing QS and going out through St John's Lane, that bus is every 5 minutes for a reason and you would end up with people all over the place and a delay issue wouldn't be solved so that is really silly. The taxi rank underground, really just make muggers job etc easier, so another silly idea as well as removing ranks, taxi drivers also have to make a living so just cut their avenues of doing so with less ranks in busy areas, really!!!, We have a council that is not bus friendly, which is not helping, there is no easy answer to this, you could make the QS to James Street area car free but there are car parks in between so that wouldn't work, the closure of the flyovers is not going to help this, even more so if they end up closed permanently. Truth is a really good park and ride is the answer but sites close to the centre and not one miles away like Gillmoss, something like they have in Norwich with several routes around all having their own buses, that is the way to go. But even something like that would only work if you made more of the centre a car free zone unless you were using the car parks with the disabled being the exception for obvious reasons.

Bus 79, yes it's busy but every 10 minutes in Queen Square would take 6 buses per hour out of there. It wouldn't make delays worse. It would confuse passengers slightly but they would get used to it. Let's face it, they already have the 79, 79C, 79D. They have got their head around there. Why not one other little change.
The Taxi Rank thing is a bit OTT but the benefits are listed above. Muggers are an issue anywhere you go. You could try part time bus stop/part time taxi rank for the evenings but then it is a lot of work to convert it for both buses and taxis to use.

Park and ride would be good but would it be used? Though Gillmoss P+R is so far out, surely it is better in that it would remove traffic from along Walton Hall Ave and closer to the city centre. The closer to the town centre it is, surely the whole scheme becomes more pointless.

[MPTE1955]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues
Of course it would mean more delays, people would just go to the existing stop and delays would happen as buses would take more time to load and there is the time wasted, so complete waste of time. Then the bus taking St John's Lane would be delayed taking more people on Brownlow hill so no gain. Pointless!! With P&R, the closer it is to the centre the better, I'll use Norwich as an example and also York, they are around 2 miles from the centre and work well. They are cheaper than parking in the centre and drivers do not have the traffic hassle of the centre, plus meaning less traffic in the centre anyway. People will use them if they are in the right place and promoted properly.

[SK15 GZG (Moderator)]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(17/10/2018 19:56)iMarkeh Wrote:  It was one whole idea. Though it would be costly, it would free up bus stops, layovers and ease congestion. Disabled parking spaces are all over Liverpool. Losing 3 won't be a big loss. I would like to add as well, if there are so many taxis waiting for a fare, I think it says a lot about the demand. So many taxi ranks, so many taxis. Very rarely see many taxis leave with passengers so really, there is far more supply than there is demand.

It still isn't going to happen

Three spaces would be a big loss actually. There aren't that many disabled parking spaces which are close to the St Johns shopping centre as it is. My father is disabled and I know for a fact it has become harder for him to find a parking space without removing any more. It is rare that he finds a space straight away and often has to drive around two or three times (sometimes more) before one is available

It is hard enough for taxi drivers to earn a living without removing taxi ranks and making it even harder

[iMarkeh]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(18/10/2018 08:39)MPTE1955 Wrote:  Of course it would mean more delays, people would just go to the existing stop and delays would happen as buses would take more time to load and there is the time wasted, so complete waste of time. Then the bus taking St John's Lane would be delayed taking more people on Brownlow hill so no gain. Pointless!! With P&R, the closer it is to the centre the better, I'll use Norwich as an example and also York, they are around 2 miles from the centre and work well. They are cheaper than parking in the centre and drivers do not have the traffic hassle of the centre, plus meaning less traffic in the centre anyway. People will use them if they are in the right place and promoted properly.

It would increase dwell time at Queen Square slightly but as less buses would be using the stand, overall the stand occupancy would be slightly lower.

I am not disputing the fact Park and Rides are good sometimes close to the city centres but they can also work out of town. Northern Ireland has quite a few park and rides. Ballymartain P&R is 12 miles away from Belfast. Sprucefield Park and Ride is 10 miles away from Belfast. Gillmoss P&R is only 5.5-6 miles away from Liverpool. Plus it is in a fantastic position for football and Aintree Racecourse. Move it closer to the city and it will be used by people to park for free/cheap and walk to the football which defeats the object.

(18/10/2018 13:50)Y474 KNF Wrote:  It is hard enough for taxi drivers to earn a living without removing taxi ranks and making it even harder

If there are that many cabs parked up in ranks awaiting a fare, obviously there isn't enough demand for them. At the end of the day, you don't go to any other city and see the endless black cab ranks. They should be on side streets and should be limited to nights on main roads. It just takes up space which could be used for other things. If there were a steady stream of taxis going in and out of the rank with people using the taxis often, it is worthwhile but I rarely see the area being used.

Chester Train Station is a great example for taxis. During the day, the taxis can only be on one side of the road and they have the 'queue'. At night (or as soon as the City Rail Link has finished), they can use both sides of the road and they have the queue. Princess Street Bus Station was good as well as you could fit a good 8-10 taxis in the taxi area but there was also space for buses. Why can't similar be done in Liverpool to maximise the use of available space. Black Cabs are mainly used at nights by those who just want a quick taxi and can't be bothered to call and wait for a car. During the day, black cabs aren't used much therefore less ranks are needed.

[EDB325]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(18/10/2018 17:14)iMarkeh Wrote:  It would increase dwell time at Queen Square slightly but as less buses would be using the stand, overall the stand occupancy would be slightly lower.

I am not disputing the fact Park and Rides are good sometimes close to the city centres but they can also work out of town. Northern Ireland has quite a few park and rides. Ballymartain P&R is 12 miles away from Belfast. Sprucefield Park and Ride is 10 miles away from Belfast. Gillmoss P&R is only 5.5-6 miles away from Liverpool. Plus it is in a fantastic position for football and Aintree Racecourse. Move it closer to the city and it will be used by people to park for free/cheap and walk to the football which defeats the object.

If there are that many cabs parked up in ranks awaiting a fare, obviously there isn't enough demand for them. At the end of the day, you don't go to any other city and see the endless black cab ranks. They should be on side streets and should be limited to nights on main roads. It just takes up space which could be used for other things. If there were a steady stream of taxis going in and out of the rank with people using the taxis often, it is worthwhile but I rarely see the area being used.

Chester Train Station is a great example for taxis. During the day, the taxis can only be on one side of the road and they have the 'queue'. At night (or as soon as the City Rail Link has finished), they can use both sides of the road and they have the queue. Princess Street Bus Station was good as well as you could fit a good 8-10 taxis in the taxi area but there was also space for buses. Why can't similar be done in Liverpool to maximise the use of available space. Black Cabs are mainly used at nights by those who just want a quick taxi and can't be bothered to call and wait for a car. During the day, black cabs aren't used much therefore less ranks are needed.

After 44 years as a black cab driver, I can safely say that you have about as much idea of how the cab trade works as I have about performing open heart surgery.

[mr t]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(18/10/2018 22:11)EDB325 Wrote:  After 44 years as a black cab driver, I can safely say that you have about as much idea of how the cab trade works as I have about performing open heart surgery.

The same as he does about operating bus services

[MPTE1955]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(18/10/2018 23:18)mr t Wrote:  The same as he does about operating bus services

Agreed,

[MPTE1955]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(18/10/2018 17:14)iMarkeh Wrote:  It would increase dwell time at Queen Square slightly but as less buses would be using the stand, overall the stand occupancy would be slightly lower.

I am not disputing the fact Park and Rides are good sometimes close to the city centres but they can also work out of town. Northern Ireland has quite a few park and rides. Ballymartain P&R is 12 miles away from Belfast. Sprucefield Park and Ride is 10 miles away from Belfast. Gillmoss P&R is only 5.5-6 miles away from Liverpool. Plus it is in a fantastic position for football and Aintree Racecourse. Move it closer to the city and it will be used by people to park for free/cheap and walk to the football which defeats the object.

If there are that many cabs parked up in ranks awaiting a fare, obviously there isn't enough demand for them. At the end of the day, you don't go to any other city and see the endless black cab ranks. They should be on side streets and should be limited to nights on main roads. It just takes up space which could be used for other things. If there were a steady stream of taxis going in and out of the rank with people using the taxis often, it is worthwhile but I rarely see the area being used.

Chester Train Station is a great example for taxis. During the day, the taxis can only be on one side of the road and they have the 'queue'. At night (or as soon as the City Rail Link has finished), they can use both sides of the road and they have the queue. Princess Street Bus Station was good as well as you could fit a good 8-10 taxis in the taxi area but there was also space for buses. Why can't similar be done in Liverpool to maximise the use of available space. Black Cabs are mainly used at nights by those who just want a quick taxi and can't be bothered to call and wait for a car. During the day, black cabs aren't used much therefore less ranks are needed.

So you want to alienate taxi drivers and stop them earning a living plus stop the convenience of people that may not have time to get a bus or wait for a private hire cab, or even have lots of shopping that they can't carry home. Taxi drivers are out at least 12 hours a day trying to earn a living and never know what they are going to earn but you want to take ranks out of the city centre. How ridiculous and you clearly have no idea.

Park and ride not closer to the centre because of football fans, think you need to realise that football fans have car parks they always go to and places they always park, think the impact of football fans would be minimal, so no idea there either.

Comparing Chester to Liverpool for taxi ranks, chalk and cheese spring to mind.

Finally the 79 issue, you have just said bus at Queen Square would take longer to load, so more time wasted there and less buses than on the stand but more time loading, plus more people squeezing on to a bus at one stop. Another ridiculous idea, I rest my case.

[FC Pictures]

RE: Liverpool City Centre Traffic Issues

(19/10/2018 06:29)MPTE1955 Wrote:  So you want to alienate taxi drivers and stop them earning a living plus stop the convenience of people that may not have time to get a bus or wait for a private hire cab, or even have lots of shopping that they can't carry home. Taxi drivers are out at least 12 hours a day trying to earn a living and never know what they are going to earn but you want to take ranks out of the city centre. How ridiculous and you clearly have no idea.

Park and ride not closer to the centre because of football fans, think you need to realise that football fans have car parks they always go to and places they always park, think the impact of football fans would be minimal, so no idea there either.

Comparing Chester to Liverpool for taxi ranks, chalk and cheese spring to mind.

Finally the 79 issue, you have just said bus at Queen Square would take longer to load, so more time wasted there and less buses than on the stand but more time loading, plus more people squeezing on to a bus at one stop. Another ridiculous idea, I rest my case.

there won`t be a 79 issue in the new year when it won`t be using Queen Square at all.