Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

[knutstransport]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(23/06/2021 07:46)Solo40336 Wrote:  Preserved buses over 20 years old will still be allowed in for non commercial work. I presume fines will be issued by ANPR, requiring preserved buses to be registered to stop any buses over 20 years old going in free.

The school contract exemption in your screenshot makes sense. At least coach hire companies won't be annulling contracts part way through an academic year because they don't have a suitable vehicle to continue running the contract.

Possibly owners of old buses will have to phone a number/submit a web form each day they take their buses out if they believe they are exempt from paying the fine? Your idea of registering the vehicle as preserved would leave a loophole if a preserved bus was loaned to a private hire company.

[Rick Hunter]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
Maybe the preserved buses exemption should be 30 years old then you will have genuine preserved buses. There are some 20+ year old buses still operating with small operators

(23/06/2021 07:46)Solo40336 Wrote:  Preserved buses over 20 years old will still be allowed in for non commercial work. I presume fines will be issued by ANPR, requiring preserved buses to be registered to stop any buses over 20 years old going in free.

[thomasl1231]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(23/06/2021 21:11)Rick Hunter Wrote:  Maybe the preserved buses exemption should be 30 years old then you will have genuine preserved buses. There are some 20+ year old buses still operating with small operators

Are my 23 and 25 year old preserved buses not genuine then? Interested to hear what I can do to make these genuine, as after spending a lot of time and money on them I do believe myself that they are genuinely preserved, however I can see that you think that isn't the case.

[joe_alker]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(23/06/2021 21:11)Rick Hunter Wrote:  Maybe the preserved buses exemption should be 30 years old then you will have genuine preserved buses. There are some 20+ year old buses still operating with small operators

And there are preserved vehicles less than 20 years old, are these not valid buses? Also if 30 years is your limit, remember that even the Museum of Transport have a 23-year-old Dennis Trident in the collection now.

[Rick Hunter]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
I'm not saying your buses aren't genuinely preserved. What I am saying is having the age limit set so low means some shady operators may claim their 20 year old vehicle is exempt because at 20 it's classed as preserved. Very few operators would operate anything 30 or over but 20 is feasible. There are still some Olympians about and the newest are over 20.


quote='thomasl1231' pid='145493' dateline='1624486650']

Are my 23 and 25 year old preserved buses not genuine then? Interested to hear what I can do to make these genuine, as after spending a lot of time and money on them I do believe myself that they are genuinely preserved, however I can see that you think that isn't the case.
[/quote]

[Mrboo]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
Well Historic (classic) vehicles under road tax rules are built before 1 January 1981.

Your vehicle will not be exempt from vehicle tax if:

it’s used for hire or reward (for example, it’s used as a taxi for paying customers)
it’s used commercially for a trade or business

So same rules you would think.

[Rick Hunter]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
Yes I'm aware some preserved vehicles are less than 20 and of course are valid. Owners of genuinely preserved vehicles cannot use them for hire or reward at all. A shady operator may use his 22 year old vehicle commercially and claim it's preserved to avoid paying the daily charge. I'm against commercial operators exploiting the concessions (cheaper tax and insurance) given to genuine preservationists.


quote='joe_alker' pid='145494' dateline='1624490133']

And there are preserved vehicles less than 20 years old, are these not valid buses? Also if 30 years is your limit, remember that even the Museum of Transport have a 23-year-old Dennis Trident in the collection now.
[/quote]

[thomasl1231]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
Ah yes! Apologoies - I see your point lol. I wonder how many operators will go for the exahust mods - it's all well and good TfGM paying for them, but once they warranty runs out it will be down to the operators to sort them out when they get clogged etc! I worked for a local company with 10 modified euro6 exhaust buses by a reputable brand, and they were out almost every week fixing issues with the exhausts for the entire time I was there! (Limp mode, emissions lights, replacing parts, performing modifications, etc).

(24/06/2021 07:03)Rick Hunter Wrote:  I'm not saying your buses aren't genuinely preserved. What I am saying is having the age limit set so low means some shady operators may claim their 20 year old vehicle is exempt because at 20 it's classed as preserved. Very few operators would operate anything 30 or over but 20 is feasible. There are still some Olympians about and the newest are over 20.


quote='thomasl1231' pid='145493' dateline='1624486650']

Are my 23 and 25 year old preserved buses not genuine then? Interested to hear what I can do to make these genuine, as after spending a lot of time and money on them I do believe myself that they are genuinely preserved, however I can see that you think that isn't the case.

[/quote]

[Mrboo]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(24/06/2021 07:14)Rick Hunter Wrote:  Yes I'm aware some preserved vehicles are less than 20 and of course are valid. Owners of genuinely preserved vehicles cannot use them for hire or reward at all. A shady operator may use his 22 year old vehicle commercially and claim it's preserved to avoid paying the daily charge. I'm against commercial operators exploiting the concessions (cheaper tax and insurance) given to genuine preservationists.


quote='joe_alker' pid='145494' dateline='1624490133']

And there are preserved vehicles less than 20 years old, are these not valid buses? Also if 30 years is your limit, remember that even the Museum of Transport have a 23-year-old Dennis Trident in the collection now.

[/quote]
But the insurer and DfT would know what it insured as.

[knutstransport]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(21/06/2021 23:59)Mrboo Wrote:  The one to keep eye on is First as they need to sort there buses out

First have always seemed to have a policy of if a bus can still be used it will still be used, even if it means cascading it to another part of the country. In the 00s First's Huddersfield depot had a collection of ex-Yorkshire Rider and ex-London deckers, while their Halifax and Bradford depots had brand new deckers. If you tell them the old buses aren't suitable for routes going in to Greater Manchester then they'll probably allocate some of the brand new ones to Halifax and Huddersfield to ensure they have suitable vehicles for cross-border services, while depots like Leeds, Bradford and Sheffield will be stuck with the older vehicles.